View Poll Results: Vote if you want to enter the contest.

Voters
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  • I want to be in the Beginners group.

    31 67.39%
  • I want to be in the Intermediates group.

    9 19.57%
  • I just want to complain about X or Y...

    6 13.04%
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
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    Canada
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    C++ contest, Beginner vs Intermediates!!

    Okay everyone, it looks like we are having a bit of an organization problem, now that the "Intermediate" group came out. So I'm taking the liberty of organizing ourselves a little contest. Please, everyone who is interested, post in THIS thread your experience. I don't want to sound too ordering, if you have a suggestion, sure, just post it here.

    I will update this front document, so it always contains the newest information.

    Please read the whole post before complaining.

    Here are the rules/guidelines of the C++ programming contest: Beginners vs Intermediates.

    -Everyone can choose a skill level that goes with his/her current abilities. No one gets rejected before projects start, you just need to properly communicate in English, and must have at least 3 hours per week to dedicate to the project. If teams get too big, we split them up and make more teams. Final teams will be decided on May 1st.
    -Each team will pick it's project, decided by all members.
    -In the end, a group of Judges will decide which team wins based on tech. quality, code modularity, usefulness/fun, etc. Maybe we could ask Buzz & crew, if they aren't too busy, if they'd like to participate judging our programs. If not, maybe we could create a poll in The Lounge and let it run for a few weeks.
    -The losing teams will have to edit their game's/game engines so that it shows at various points of the game messages like "Team X rocks!" (asuming Team X won).
    -In the spirit of Buzzies, I say both projects should be open source. This should a learning experience project, not a money-making project. What teams do next with their creation is up to them.
    -In the end, all teams write a few tutorials, overview's, etc. of their experiences, so that new c++ users can benefit from this too.
    -We thank and make publicity for 3dbuzz (specially their c++ VTM's) in our websites, code, etc.
    -The contest time should be about 4 months. Open to suggestions here.
    -Current expected timeframe: On saturday april 23 we decide on what project we will make. You then have 1 week to relax, think about it, break up with your girlfriends/boyfriends, learn your stuff, etc. Contest starts on sunday May 1st. By that time, I'll post the final teams (no admissions after that), and then it's up to them.
    -In the spirit of friendship, teams will be randomly selected by me. Why me? I don't know, but trust me, it will be random. I have no personal preference on teammates (unless there is a really hot girl who wants to enter the contest, of course ). If someone really wants to be in the team with someone else, I guess it could be done, if no one else has a problem with it. What CAN'T be done, is saying: "I do NOT want to be in the team with someone..."
    -Percent20 is trying to get us a CVS, so we can develop in it. I'm not sure what it is, but it sounds cool . Also, Porter3** has offered a server with webspace. Thanks to both!!

    The rules for entering each team are:

    Beginners:
    -Must at least know basic C++. Months of experience don't matter. You must be able to handle classes, functions and pointers well.
    -None-to-basic experience with external API's, such as wxWidgets, OpenGL, etc.
    -None-to-medium algorithms knowledge.
    -Willingness to learn!

    Intermediates:
    -Everything the intermediates, plus:
    -Good knowledge of standard functions in C++, and know at least a bit about algorithms.
    -Must be proficient with at least one external API.
    -Must NOT have worked profesionally or with a team in "real" software. Come on, this is just a learning experience.
    -Willingness to learn!

    Before you complain about being unfair, yes, of course it is. Life's unfair!

    If you take a closer look, I'm putting myself on the beginners team. I know we'll probably lose, but THAT'S the motivation! (Come on, beginners, lets work hard so we beat the comilers out of those geeky code-writing, software-developing-intermediate-C++programer-wannabe's!! )

    EVERYONE WHO WANTS IN, PUT YOUR INFO ON THE THREADS STARTED BY RAMBOMADCOW.

    Please, do tell me if I'm missing someone, or if someone else wants to join. And please vote in the page if you want to join, I made it so it's easier to keep track of who's were.

    Current possible projects (we will decide later what teams must do):
    -A 2d game engine for either RTS, mario-style-platformer, or isometric RPG. Notice that this means we make a simple game, showing our engine's features, and judges will just focus on the engine, not game itself. The game engine can be for many different types of games too.
    -A real game. That means that focus is on the game itself, not game development. RPG, adventure, mario-style-platformer, RTS, etc. Same categories as above.
    -An expansion to Evil Monkey's!!
    -A desktop game. That means a tetris/asteroids/etc. style game.

    Edit: I changed the timeframe(s) and added team members, added team split info, etc. Also, I added "current possible projects", so we keep some kind of track, and you don't have to read the whole thread in case you are wondering.
    Last edited by Xorlium; 04-21-2005 at 09:22 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    little rock arkansas
    Posts
    3,482

    Talking

    i am in the middle of both...still do not understand how to make dll's and static libs
    so i chose to complain
    can we all just work on something together
    everyone contribute in there own way
    x does website
    z does gut
    a does error loggin utility
    g does all the putting stuff together
    hf does the planning
    sombody else can do the design document
    find your strengths and work with those
    ME WANT AGENTS ME WANT AGENTS ME WANT AGENTS

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    682
    i am in the middle of both...still do not understand how to make dll's and static libs
    so i chose to complain
    can we all just work on something together
    everyone contribute in there own way
    x does website
    z does gut
    a does error loggin utility
    g does all the putting stuff together
    hf does the planning
    sombody else can do the design document
    find your strengths and work with those
    I figured a contest with deadlines would be a lot more encouraging for beginners than a "do what you can" style of relaxed project.

    If what we want is a really good and usable app (or playable game for that matter), then yes, probably 1 team working together would be better. But for learning purposes, two smaller teams would work better. With just one team, we won't understand every part of the program. With 2, everyone will understand every part of their program.

    Maybe we can do that after the contest is over (and intermediates are advanced, and beginners are intermediate). A joint project.

    And I put you in the intermediates, since it's what you resemble the most.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bellevue, WA
    Posts
    3,251
    Quote Originally Posted by Xorlium
    -Must NOT have worked profesionally or with a team in
    Darn... so what about an advanced team then?

    "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." ~Rich Cook

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
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    Canada
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    Darn... so what about an advanced team then?
    http://www.sourceforge.net

    Search for a team you like and go with them

    Or hey, I have an idea. What do you think?
    The advanced guys could lead the teams! Maybe you could lead one, and halma the other!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bellevue, WA
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    Hehe, that was a good one.

    Leading a team... I don't know. Could be fun and interesting, but I don't think you'll learn as much that way. I think a consultant position would be more appropriate and more beneficial to all. i.e. someone to assess skills and give feedback but not to be a driving force to get a team going or keep the team managed.

    "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." ~Rich Cook

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Canada
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    682
    Yeah, you're probably right...

    Well, if some team doesn't know how to do something, maybe we can just consult the guru's. Maybe you can check our project, once it's started, and give us a few tips...

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Bellevue, WA
    Posts
    3,251
    Wow... just saw the timeline, 9 months!!! That's a long time. Heh, and that will extend past the C++ VTMs release date... wonder how many projects will change because of that .

    Sure, I wouldn't mind being a consultant on a project. Just let me know via PM or something.

    One thing about the team size... I'd try to keep it down. Probably around 5 max - large teams get to be extremely difficult to manage and spend more time in communication then anything else. What would be awesome to do if you have a large group, say like 10, would be to break the team into two groups of 5. Then have the two groups work on different pieces (such as modelling, UI, network communication, etc...) and then integrate the two. This will take a good design from the beginning so proper interfaces could be created, but could really increase productivity if done properly. Then the leaders from the two groups would communicate with each other and then go back to their respective team members and relay the information. Or you could simply have multiple teams...

    Also, you might want to pick a genre and focus for the contest that way there would be at least some quantitative way to judge each project.


    "Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning." ~Rich Cook

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Alabama USA
    Posts
    632
    No harm done Xorlium but I was wondering if you came up with the contest idea on your own (two minds thinking alike here), or if you expanded on the idea that Metal and myself actually threw out there. If you thought of it on your own that's too funny to me. If you read the original post about the contest and are expanding on it then I give a very big BRAVO! Nicely organized. I like the teams you have set up and I personnaly feel they're right. I also agree with the idea of it being a competition and not a giant group effort for the exact reason you stated. Us beginners need to learn all the inner workings of C++ before we start having a certain area we like best and become very proficient at. I'm getting all kinds of chills and very excited about this. I'm ready to rock and roll.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Scotland
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    I am happy working in the intermediate group, I am learning OpenGL and wxWidgets right now, have a few working games (for pc and GBA). I know C, C++, flash and VB. I have alot of time to devote to this project and am happy doing anything for it (learning C#/java, making UI's etc)

    Personaly, I use XP so it would have to be compatable with that (unless I used knoppix or something), I like the idea of open source, but I dont think it should be realsed until we are finnished/in the testing phase. Setting up sourceForge accounts is a great idea, plus it can act as a web page until (if) we set one up.
    Anyway, I am really looking forward to this, I love challenges.

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